When I speak about Fat Acceptance I can not pretend that I am speaking for each and every person who takes “Health At Every Size” to heart. I am sure there are exceptions. Discussions about Fat Acceptance have to be done in general terms. My generalizations come from my years of reading fat acceptance blogs, and the experiences of others who had the misfortune of dealing with this angry internet mob. Anyone who has had an intellectual “run in” with fat bloggers will tell you that they absolutely positively can not tolerate differing opinions.
On their own turf, the FA blogs, the thought police are always on patrol, in a fashion that Stalin would be proud of. It begins with name calling and public humiliation. Kate Harding is an expert at creating new derivatives of foul words to insult those that would dare to disagree with her. Her favorites seem to be “Fucktard” and “douchehound“. Wow, how creative, I see she is putting her graduate degree to good use. After the public verbal thrashing she bans them. Fat bloggers have no use for someone that might have an independent thought once in a while. The comment sections are for loud “AMENS” only. Please look at Kate Harding’s rules for comments, this has to be the most Byzantine set of rules for blog comments EVER!
Another intellectual suppression tactic is the lack of connecting links to sites and sources that they disagree with. Here is an example in a fat blog post, where the lack of a links is strangely obvious. I’m not sure if they are worried that the links will attract trolls, aka people who have independent ideas, or that they are worried, like most cults, that exposure to outside ideas might lure disciples away. Either way this attempt to close off the outside world, by restricting the conversation, by all tests, qualifies as a form of censorship.
Shutting down the open discussion of obesity isn’t limited to the fat acceptance blogs. Whenever the subject comes up on the open internet, a concerted effort to drowned out debate is made. FA devotees become internet bullies whenever they can. Should a web author be bold enough to question their movement on a blog, or a forum it can be guaranteed that post after post will be made implying that the original post is full of hate, and that the author has a “no fat chicks” sticker on his pick up truck bumper. Just read through the comments section on my last post to see what I mean. The pro fat acceptance comments are often longer that my blog post!
When all this fails, out right attempts of censorship ensue. Of course the FA blogs and forums will not claim responsibility for the formal complaints to Web Hosting Services, and Advertisers. But, when I started www.myfatspouse.com two years ago everything was fine until the fat o sphere discovered my site. Since then I have had to deal with a steady stream of complaints to my web hosting service, and my advertisers. In the beginning, I had to do some hard core self defense, but now they just blow them off. Props to Blue Host and Google for understanding that I am not preaching hate. It hasn’t stopped FA fanatics from continuing to try to force me to shut up as this editorial response to an article detailing my site proves.
Even more telling about Fat Acceptance’s views on censorship is their feelings toward Pro-Ana sites. Just recently a contributer from “Shaply Prose” was cheering on a French decision to ban sites that advocate anorexia and bulimia. I suggest you read her entire post. Scary huh? Apparently Fillyjoink doesn’t even think about the fact that she is posting this on a well read blog that advocates obesity. I don’t know what the numbers are in France, but in the United States obesity claims 300,000 lives prematurely according to the CDC, while the figure for Anorexia is in the 200 range, in data given by the World Health Organization. I know I have stated these numbers before, but I’m going to keep repeating them until the disparity of these two numbers starts to sink in!
When Fat Acceptance is unwilling to take on differing opinions, and tries to silence critics, it is a self admission that they know that their arguments and their facts are weak. Pretending as if they are avoiding fatty bashers and trolls only goes so far. Especially when they make special efforts to get the plug pulled on websites they don’t care for. Trite as it sounds censorship is the last refuge of those who haven’t got a leg to stand on. The argument for fat acceptance is more about denial of the facts, than arguing the facts, and they know it.
You make some excellent point! I don’t agree with pro-ana sites, but how are they going to support those sites being illegal when they are supporting being overweight, many of them to an extreme? Why don’t they make it illegal to ban promoting obesity?
The crack acceptance movement http://parallelsidewalk.wordpress.com/2008/04/19/the-crack-acceptance-movement/
What a joy to find a blog with some intelligence on it.
The level of delusion amongst the obese never ceases to amaze me, its not just in America its a world wide problem.
Here is a NZ site that supports and promotes obesity http://www.realwomen.co.nz
The arrogance displayed in the claim that obesity = real (whatever that means) seems lost on these sad fools.
I couldn’t agree more. I, myself, am overweight (and steadily losing the extra pounds), so I suppose this makes me a self-hating fatty to the militant fat acceptance mob. I had tried to get involved in the fatshionista community since I’m fat and I do love fashion. Silly me – I thought it was about fashion, not a vicious mob of PMSing fat women who jumped down the throat of anyone who even entertained the idea of living healthy. If you appear to not like the idea of weighing 200 lbs, it’s as if they think you’re a fat hater, and a traitor, and they think they can throw “facts” at you (95% of diets don’t work, fat people live longer – all clearly bull) to make you change your mind and embrace the flab. Not going to happen. I’ve never come across such an ignorant petty mob of people on the internet before, which is saying a lot since 95% of the internet is morons.
I find it refreshing to read this post, after I received a long, angry email from a friend saying that we are no longer friends because of posts on my blog about how fatness costs society money and how I don’t want to date morbidy obese men. I don’t see why I should date morbidly obese men, especially after reading your other site, Chris, which details graphically how morbidly obese men can’t get it up.
[...] home on their HEAVILY censored blogs and forums, the true face of fat acceptance comes out. Thinly guised hatred toward thin people [...]
Wow….just read those “rules” and I have to agree with you. Why even bother posting on (Kate Hardings) such a mean, hateful blog? Whats the point in discussion and open sharing of ideas? It seems to be a blog created for the sole intention of self-glorification and narcissism.
I found this one particularly scary:
“Fourth rule: If you even fucking mention “free speech” with regard to my comments policy, you will be banned”
This comes in COMPLETE contradiction with this rule:
“Ninth rule: Be aware that if you posted a coherent, reasonable, and respectful comment and it didn’t show up, you probably got trapped in the spam filter”
Reasonable/respectful comments can STILL be banned because free speech doesn’t apply one way or the other. So there really is no point in even visiting such a self-deluded bunch. Wow…just…wow…she must be horribly, horribly unhappy…
[...] those who parrot her ideas, these aren’t just beliefs, they are absolute religious axioms which SHALL NOT be disagreed with. Even the slightest difference in opinion or even the being perceived as being in disagreement, [...]
I have had run ins with militant types before and in fact just blogged about the topic today.
I think, as I happened to mention there, that the anger comes from pain. The pain of being an outcast in a society that is just fine with you being an outcast.
Although I consider myself a fat feminist and a champion of good self esteem, it’s important to keep communication lines open, not shut them down. That doesn’t help anybody. It also isn’t very persuasive because you’re only preaching to the choir that way.
Pro ana-mia sites make me sad and scare me and I think they are wrong. The disparity between your numbers in health related issues seems persuasive at first, but you are not taking a lot of things into account when you look at the simple death numbers.
If the subject is health, neither eating large quantities of sugar-laden, fat-laden, trans-fat filled food is good nor is starving and obsessing and taking laxatives, vomiting etc.
However, more and more studies are showing that you can be well above those ridiculous height-weight table guidelines and still be healthy. In fact being fatter girl who feels good about herself and exercises is probably a lot healthier than a girl starving herself, vomiting and taking laxatives.
I wish we could all come together and lift each other up, rather than tear each other down.
Censorship is not the answer, but championing pro-ana-mia cause is no sword I’d want to die on.
Nobody here is pro-ana. Period. There are a small handful of pro-ana sites but by and large it is a bogeyman created by FA to tar anybody who doesn’t believe that morbid obesity is a healthy lifestyle. Nobody is advocating “starving and obsessing and taking laxatives, vomiting etc”. Fat acceptance is one extreme, pro-ana is another. A simple acceptance of healthy eating and exercise patterns is the middle ground that FA can’t accept and has to recast as its opposite. I appreciate the conciliatory tone but the truth is you’re sort of using strawman arguments to make it sound as if someone has to either eat a ton of unhealthy shit or be “starving herself, vomiting and taking laxatives”. It’s like saying someone who isn’t freezing to death must be self-immolating.
Perhaps I inferred that this site was supportive of pro-ana-mia by the general tone? Thank you for clearing it up.
Your comment that my tone is conciliatory indicates that you are assuming I have some sort of ulterior motive other than what I plainly stated. I am intensely interested in this topic and read with great interest the positions and points made in one direction or the other.
I have from time to time been known to go an a rant in defense of fat girls, but I think that some people are just totally closed off to the ideas.
From the approximately five posts I have read on this site and the material I read on myfatspouse.com I started to get the sense that this site and myfatspouse are in favor of whatever it takes to lose weight for your spouse. Perhaps it’s the anger in post after post and the constant snarky comments about the FA people and how ridiculous it is for them to feel this way or that way.
I think it’s important to understand each others anger and pain. To try and find that happy balance point.
I would never stop somebody from dieting if they felt like they’d not been eating well. I just get tired of the constant message that if you don’t fall into that mainstream media idea of beauty that you are a worthless blob.
I posted my comment in terms of extremes – eating too much or starving, because that is what I see on this site: extremes.
I feel that when weight begins to cause health problems and immobility that you probably should see a doctor and figure out what is wrong with your dietary habits and get some exercise. We all should be exercising, it’s good for us! But if you are a size 22 woman and you change to healthier eating habits and exercise more and you only ever get down to a size 18, then you shouldn’t have to feel ashamed or that you have somehow disrespected your spouse. From what I can tell on this site size 16 or 18 are not considered acceptable. That is the tone I was responding to.
I don’t think that Myfatspouse, contrary to the FA-blogs, has any distinct ideology or agenda. It’s an open and very lightly moderated forum and we, so to speak, get all sorts of people. The tone of the discussions vary and the arguments can get heated. Sometimes people say a bit shocking and extreme things and censorship is a last resort. If someone, for example, says that a certain size is acceptable but another size is not, it is only the opinion of this person and anyone would be welcome to argue against it.
One theme that keeps coming up is how people react when they first become aware of the existence of the FA-blogs. It’s usually amazement and disbelief, and a sense that the world has suddenly gone mad. This is probably very much due to the fact that they deny all negative health effects of obesity, and don’t allow any dissenting opinions.
As a result people go from not giving much thought to the fat/obese people they encounter in their daily lives to suddenly seeing FA-extremists everywhere, and feel a compelling need to preach about the dangers of the ideology.
Thank you Mary. However, I do think that the tagline for myfatspouse alone gives a strong implication of the general tone of the site.
My impressions were based on the things I clicked on and read. Perhaps if I’d spent a bit more time I would have seen more of what you are referring to.
My site is one FA site that does not squash dissent.
HTTP://BIGGERFATTERBLOG.BLOGSPOT.COM
We take on fat hatred without being hateful. Stop by and we can agree to disagree.
I think if Kate Harding had a good feed session with ProudFA my blog’s co owner she would be a bit less ornery.
I think she’s hungry. We fat people can become very grouchy when we get rumblings in our tummies.
I don’t think anyone here is advocating unhealthy weight loss methods. I think a lot of people are just angry at the way weight loss has been depicted in the FA universe. There are plenty of ways to lose weight and be healthy at the same time. Starvation diets are bad and often make you look worse than when you started due to muscle loss, and they are less sustainable. But resistance train 3x a week and eat a clean 500-1000 calories below maintenance and you’ll lose weight AND be healthy.
I think the real issue – at least for me – is the constant focus on HOW WOMEN LOOK as opposed to what they are putting in their mouth. Not as in HOW MUCH really, but the quality of food they are eating. And the other thing is exercise. Exercise is very important for good health. The thing is you can eat good foods and get adequate exercise and still be considered fat and even obese.
I do not advocate eschewing exercise because you think that means you are giving in to the mainstream idea of beauty or something. Realize people can be fat and healthy. A value of a human being is not in their size. A person is not less valuable if they are fat. It doesn’t mean they are lazy either. There are plenty of thin lazy people – I’ve met some!
It’s judging a book by its cover. That’s not fair.
Some of the extremist FA stuff is as bad and wrong as the extremist “you gotta lose weight you ugly cow” side is.
Eat healthy food. Get some exercise. Accept your body and love it. Just try to be the best version of you that you can be and not some supermodel. That’s all!
Also Chris – when people advocate losing weight and call you disrespectful and that you are gaining on purpose (the tagline for this blog’s sister) then you ARE advocating for whatever it takes to lose the weight. That makes losing the weight more important and the way a person looks more important than who they are. Our mortal coils are not all that we are. Even I have to revisit that thought sometimes.